12th armoured car - did it exist?

[tobias]

Hi,

i've found a document of my fathers (who was canadian and now deceased) referring to being posted to the "12th ARM. CAR REGt as SQN LDR"

problem is, i can't find a candian 12th armoured car regiment that existed during ww2.

so my question is, did a candian regiment with that designation exist, or am i looking in the wrong place?

any help would be greatly appreciated,

toby

[Antipodean Andy]

Possibly an RAF unit, Tobias, or similar.

Welcome to the forum! Hope you enjoy it here.

Andy

[Antipodean Andy]

I did a little digging and have determined it is a Canadian Army unit that was based at Crookham, Hants, England in 1943/44.

Do a google search for "12th armoured car regiment" and sift through the Aussie unit references with the same name and you'll find a couple of Canadian references. Doesn't appear much though so suspect I'm looking in the wrong spot.

[Kyt]

There are two possibilities Toby. Either he was transferred to the Australian 12 Armoured Car Regiment - a possibility but highly unlikely, or that it is short hand for the 18th Armoured Car Regiment (12th Manitoba Dragoons)

WarMuseum.ca - 12th Manitoba Dragoons

Do you know where he served - that may narrow it down?

[Antipodean Andy]

I think Kyt has hit on this one:

Armoured Car - www.canadiansoldiers.com

During the Second World War, several types of armoured cars were brought into service, primarily for reconnaissance duties.2 There were two main types of units equipped with armoured cars - the Armoured Car Regiment and the Reconnaissance Regiment. Armoured cars and trucks saw widespread service in other roles by the end of the war, being used as command vehicles, ambulances, ammunition and troop carriers, and gun tractors.

Armoured Car Regiments
1st Armoured Car Regiment (Royal Canadian Dragoons) - served as the I Canadian Corps reconnaissance asset, and from Jul 1944 to Mar 1945 as 1st Canadian Division Reconnaissance Regiment
18th Armoured Car Regiment (12th Manitoba Dragoons) - served as the II Canadian Corps reconnaissance asset.
Reconaissance Regiments
4th Reconnaissance Regiment (IV Princess Louise's Dragoon Guards) - served as the 1st Canadian Infantry Division reconnaissance asset.
7th Reconnaissance Regiment (17th Duke of York's Royal Canadian Hussars) - served as the 3rd Canadian Infantry Division reconnaissance asset.
8th Reconnaissance Regiment (14th Canadian Hussars) - served as the 2nd Canadian Infantry Division reconnaissance asset.
Armoured Regiments and Armoured Reconnaissance Regiments were both organized with tanks rather than armoured cars, though armoured cars were used in the intercommunication troop of regimental headquarters.

Many other units also utilized armoured cars, including infantry battalions (as headquarters vehicles), engineers, service troops, etc.

[tobias]

thanks for the welcome,

you guys are good - i was hoping for a reply, but didn't expect one this quickly.

i know he served with the RCD's for a while and the forestry corps in scotland, but i'm trying to figure out the rest from some scant notes he left me. he died when i was 3, he was much older than my mum and no one really knows what he got up to during the war - the canadian archives do furnish old records but are currently taking six months to turn them around, so i'm trying to come at the problem from another angle.

i had found the crookham, hants angle but seeing as though there was only one reference to it on the whole web, i figured that someone else might be mistaken too.

the thing that i couldn't figure out is why my dad would refer to the 18th Armoured Car Regiment (12th Manitoba Dragoons) as the "12th ARM. CAR REGt". wouldn't someone note it down as the 18th ARM. CAR REGt, or am i missing something special about the 12th manitoba dragoons designation?

toby
(an aussie in toronto with very cold toes)

[Antipodean Andy]

We're not sure about it all either, Tobias!

[Kyt]

Having dug around a bit more I think we can discount the Australian angle because they didn't last long as a unit.

As to why it was referred to as the 12th rather than the 18th, it may just have been an affectation because of the parent unit.

Have you tried contacting Mapleleaf? They are the ones for Canadian units:

Introduction to Maple Leaf Up!

[sniper]

Toby, Try emailing Kevin Eyre who is the editor of History's Witness. If you PM me i'll send you his email address. His speciality is Canadian Divisions during June/July 1944 that landed at Juno Beach. Not sure if he'll be able to help but you never know who else he knows who may know the answer.

Best of luck with your search

Sniper

[spidge]

Hi Toby,

These are the deaths that are recorded for the 18th and subsequent 12th which may be of use to you.

Geoff's Search Engine