Grandfather in Stalag VIIA

[Kyt]

51H, were the 5th Camerons the para battalion or was that the 7th? I know the paras were involved in Italy, but not sure how the redesignation worked.

[51highland]

7th battalion was converted to a parachute battalion in August 1942 and redesignated 5th (Scottish) Parachute battalion. they saw action in N Africa, Italy, South of France and Greece. As a clarification to my last, 4th Camerons (Captured at St Valery) were redesignated as the new 2nd Camerons on 2nd December 1942, the original 2nd Camerons being captured at Tobruk, June 1942.

[Roxy]

Mates,

Thanks very much. POW after Aug 1943 is a start (although he was imprisoned in Germany). I suspected that he might have been 2 Camerons - just need to find official confirmation (or otherwise, of course). However, my family have a history of telling 'porkies' to their offspring - he may never have been in Italy!!

Roxy

Incidentally, the response to my query so far has been outstanding. Thanks folks!

[51highland]

The 79th News that Roxy was referring to. Front and the Covenant / constitution on the back. It was printed 6 monthly during the war years, by Northern Counties Newspaper and printing co. ltd. Margaret Street, Inverness.

[Roxy]

I've been back to Fort George recently and discovered that he left the HQ Coy 2nd Camerons as L Cpl in 1934 - transferred to the Army Reserve. He then rejoined in April 1939 (L Cpl (Unpaid)) posted to 1 Camerons. I could find nothing in 79th News during the war; although it does list all members of the regiment killed in action, died of wounds, wounded, taken POW and those who died as POW - nothing. I will look agian (wood v trees!)

I'll keep you all updated.

Roxy

[Roxy]

Roxy's latest update.

I have just heard back from ICRC. It seems that my grandad was captured at Anzio on 29 May 1944. ICRC received confirmation from the Germans that he was present at ReserveLazarett Rottenmunster on 20 Jun 1944 (a military hospital - I can't find many detail on the web). The ICRC also confrim that he was transferred to Stalag VIIA at Moosburg from Stalag VB at Villingen, near Ludswigburg on 1 Aug 1944.

Can anyone point to where I can find out what QOCH (or RSF) were doing at Anzio in May/Jun 1944?

Roxy

[Kyt]

Hi Roxy,

in post #3 I posted a link to the history of the Scots. Details on Anzio start on page 134 (in the word document).

On the morning of May 29 came reports that the enemy had retreated, and “C” Company, after probing with a patrol, advanced into The Horseshoe. “B” and “D” Companies, moving fast but cautiously, were soon able to report that they were clear of the minefields and over the Moletta, and by midday had gained the level plain beyond. Battalion Headquarters followed at once.

Before 2 p.m., however,” C” Company ran into an ambush, and its leading platoon lost one man killed and four wounded. Up to this point the broad line of advance had been towards the village of Ardea, which was later to be captured by the Wilt-shires. The Battalion had gained its first objective, which consisted of a wood and hill on the far bank of the Moletta. Shortly after the ambush, however, orders were received to work down a long spur on the left front towards the farmhouse of La Fossa, with the object of trapping the Germans as they withdrew from the north bank of the river. This fresh direction brought the Battalion, after clearing the riverside, into level fields surrounding La Fossa farm, the new objective. The Fusiliers advanced steadily in extended order across this featureless ground, “B” Company on the left with the reconstituted “C” Company a short distance behind it. For the first 500 yards the only enemy reaction was an occasional burst of Spandau fire, but half an hour after beginning the advance across the plain the Battalion encountered a well placed and cunningly concealed German rearguard force, which opened intense fire with mortars and machine guns. This was immediately followed by a heavy artillery concentration, evidently prepared for such a target. The companies dropped into the long grass of the exposed plain and endured continuous fire from three sides. There was virtually no cover, and at that juncture no possibility of movement in any direction. The only hope of survival lay in calling down a concentration of artillery fire on the German positions. This however was prevented by a disaster of the first magnitude. Major Batey, commanding “R” (593) Battery of 156 Field Regiment, who was with the Battalion on the plain as forward observation officer, was killed by the German shell fire directed on the Fusiliers. His wireless set was destroyed at the same time, and therefore no signal could be passed to the guns. The Battalion was thus left with rifles and Bren guns only to pit against the heavy armament of the Germans; cut off and unable to communicate, it stayed to ground for three-quarters of an hour, while casualties mounted.

At approximately 4 p.m. the Germans sent about 100 men forward from their concealed positions to attack the two platoons on the right of” B “Company, which were completely overpowered and for the most part taken prisoner. Fifteen minutes later, faced with the prospect of complete destruction if the Battalion stayed longer, Colonel Boyle gave orders for retirement to the first objective. Throughout the half mile of the return journey the intensity of the enemy fire was maintained without a pause and continued to impose casualties. Colonel Boyle, having waited to see the two forward companies and the reserve company go past him, remained behind to help two wounded Fusiliers. As he walked towards the men he was shot through the head. Major J. L. Maxwell assumed command of the Battalion, which continued to suffer further casualties until some rough ground on the north bank of the Moletta was regained. A company of the Seaforth had formed a firm base through which the remnants of the Battalion passed to the rear, where they concentrated. The Scots Fusiliers had lost on that afternoon of May 29 about 140 of all ranks, killed, wounded and missing. When the Germans, who had followed up the Battalion as it fell back, later withdrew, a search was made on the plain for wounded and missing. Although some were found, the reduction in the strength of the Battalion remained at about 100. Seven officers were casualties: Colonel Boyle killed; Major J. Williamson and Lieutenant W. M. Rogerson wounded; and Lieutenants P. R. E. Willey, A. Watt, C. 0. Crighton and J. Le Gallais taken prisoner. As Colonel Maxwell observes: “It was a heart-breaking finish to Anzio and, for us, of the Italian Campaign.”

[Roxy]

Kyt,

Thanks. (Oops!) I'll re-read your post. 29 May 44, with the number of RSF killed, wounded and missing, certainly tallies with the date of my grandad's capture. I still can't fathom why he would have gone from a L Cpl in the Camerons to a Pte in the RSF. If/when I find out, I'll let you all know.

Roxy

[Roxy]

I have just bought 'Anzio' by Lloyd Clark (£6 in Tesco). If Lloyd is correct (and I have no reason to doubt that he is) then my grandad was not it the Camerons when captured at Anzio - they were not in the orbat. It seems that he may have been in 2 RSF (17 Bde, 5 Div under the command of Maj Gen P G S Gregson-Ellis) after all.

Roxy

[Kyt]

Hi Roxy

one of checking is through this book PRISONERS OF WAR 1939-45. VOLUME ONE Obvioudly the book is too expensive for just one query but it maybe available via the library. It should contain his unit.

BTW, I don't think we ever asked his name. Sometimes The Times published POW lists (just saying that they are now POWs) and I maybe able to check