Fairey Battle

[Kyt]

Afraid there's no internal diagrams Adrian. But I'll send it by email tomorrow anyway.

[Antipodean Andy]

I think Hendon has a complete Battle and that might be the one Kyt linked to (haven't been to that site yet). There's one down here in South Australia being put together slowly as well (we used them for gunnery training of air gunners). Iceland rings a bell for wreckage as well but will have to trawl for that lot.

[Kyt]

Not the best pictures but the only internal ones I can find

Looking from the Cockpit backwards


Gunners Position forward

[Kyt]

Originally Posted by Andy in West Oz

I think Hendon has a complete Battle and that might be the one Kyt linked to (haven't been to that site yet). There's one down here in South Australia being put together slowly as well (we used them for gunnery training of air gunners). Iceland rings a bell for wreckage as well but will have to trawl for that lot.

Yep, that's the Hendon one, which is the one that was found in Iceland.

And for the Australian Battles:

http://www.adf-serials.com/

Go to RAAF Series 2, and then A22

[Antipodean Andy]

http://www.belleair.co.uk/diving/wreck_note.asp

Battle in Malta? Target tug? Comms aircraft?

The British ‘S’ class Submarine HMS Stubborn lays upright and intact in 57 metres of water on a sand seafloor about a mile out of St. Paul’s Bay.
The remains of a German ‘E’ Boat which came to grief whilst laying sea-mines just outside the harbour at Marsascala, resting in 40 metres of water.
A 19th century paddle-steamer - HMS Hellespont used by the allies during the 1940’s can be found upright and intact on the seabed in about 50 metres of water out of Grand Harbour.
Close by, the Admiral of the Fleet Barge HMS St. Angelo which also lies upright and intact on a sand/gravel seabed at a similar depth. In the same area and similar depth the Minesweeper HMS Eddy and a cable layer are perfectly preserved wrecks.
For many years a few privileged divers had ventured to dive the wreck of a Blenheim Bomber aircraft out of Marsascala in 40 metres of water and then wandered to the resting places of the many allied and axis aircraft that were known to have entered the sea close to shore.
In the last months of 2004 the wreck of a British Bristol Beaufighter aircraft was relocated (after its initial discovery in the 1970’s) some 500 metres out of Sliema in just under 40 metres of water. The aircraft was ditched after the pilot experienced problems after taking off from Luqa Airfield en-route for a raid on shipping in Sicilian waters. Both crewmembers escaped unharmed.
Ongoing is the search for a WW2 Spitfire and Fairey Battle both of which have been pinpointed but require further in-depth investigation.
For the advanced diver, the giant passenger-liner Polynesian lays on a sloping seabed some 3 miles out from Marsascala. This massive wreck was sent to the seafloor after encountering enemy action during 1917 and is rarely dived.

[Antipodean Andy]

http://www.bamfbamrs.be/Battle/FaireyBattleR3950.htm

[Antipodean Andy]

http://www.oca.269squadron.btinterne...rey_battle.htm

[Adrian Roberts]

Hi Kyt & Andy
I was gob-smacked to see that there is after all a Battle in the RAF Museum! I hadn't been there since I was a boy, but then I went there twice last year (because I didn't get all round the first time), and again this year (for the Cross&Cockade AGM), but I don't remember seeing a Battle. This could well be just down to me: going round somewhere like the RAFM is like eating a whole box of chocolates in one go; I spend so long looking at every rivet on the first few exhibits I come to that I am in a daze by mid-afternoon and rush round the second half. So I may well have bypassed the Battle and a lot else besides. On the other hand, the photo above was clearly taken some years ago - I know this because the Sikorsky R-4B Hoverfly in the background is now in the Milestones of Flight Exhibition in the new hall, so possibly the Battle got sent to Cosford or Duxford when they rearranged. And co-incidentally I was reading Aeroplane Monthly last night and they said there are four Battles in existence,, including one in Belgium.

However, as Taylor states in the Fairey book, the Battle was seen by everyone as obsolete even whilst the first few aircraft were being rolled out. That's a couple of years before the war started! However, the RAF just didn't have any other alternative at that time as a replacement.

It must have been very disconcerting to know the Battle was not going to survive in a contemporary combat environment, but not to have any alternative. Was there any aircraft in the world that they had their eye on? The Blenheim was scarcely faster, had no better defensive armament and the same bombload. The Stuka was slower, but possibly more accurate in dive-bomber mode, which may have made missions seem less futile. The Mosquito was of course the real answer, but in 1937 it was still a twinkle in the eye of Geoffrey De Havilland and Ronald Bishop.

The interior photos that Kyt posted appear to show the Observer's bomb-aiming well, in the floor. The last of the photos in the IPMS link shows a view of the underside, showing the cooling exit, and behind that three apertures apparently covered in perspex, which must have been the opening hatch for the bombsight (draughty and vertiginious when open I should imagine). This hatch appears to have been further aft that the "Flight" diagram in the pdf, therefore behind the main-spar carry-through.

The rear gun stowage arrangements (in the IPMS pictures) are very similar to those in the contemporary TBD Devastator (attached below).

[Antipodean Andy]

AR, the link in post #16 is the Belgian Battle if you haven't seen her before.

Sometimes I feel as though the Battle was the interim aircraft when biplane bombers were being phased out but nothing decent monoplane-wise had been designed as a "culture-shift" in what bombers should be was still under way. Despite its shortcomings, I think the Blenheim was the first real attempt at a modern British bomber. After all, when it flew, it was faster than the fighters at the time. Obviously it was caught up with pretty quickly but it presented a leap forward by proving bombers didn't have to be lumbering things. The Battle was another attempt at this (thinking differently) but, I think, put too much reliance on the Merlin.

Interesting that two pivotal British light bombers, the Blenheim and Mossie, started off as private ventures.

Having said all that, and going back to AR's comments about knowing the inadequacies of your aircraft, surely Battle men were the bravest of the brave? Mind you, all aircrew were brave no matter their nationality or aircraft. The early RAF bomber crews in the war, though, never cease to amaze me. Interesting to note that a lot of the leaders I come across in my reading on the Med theatre had already completed a tour out of the UK before being posted to warmer climes. Amazing people.